Caralis~

[bexgames]

Ok, I officially suck at the Caralis level. It is taking me F-O-R-E-V-E-R.
The prosperity level which demands very happy equites and patricians is KILLER. sheesh. Plus, now Rome out and out demands denarii...I am going to be there forever, unless yet another wave of barbarians finally gets to me. :(
Anybody else stuck here? Other than just better homes, what else can I do for prosperity?

[bexgames]

Also, check this out, in order to evolve, I needed walls, but had no room due to aquaduct running behind the homes, so when I tried to squeeze the walls in, it built right ON the aquaduct!! you see the channel?
I've never noticed this before, and comes in handy when you have no room...:cool:

[Pi-Xerxes]

That is very interesting find! :eek:

Do the walls have to enclose the area 100% in order to evolve your housing?

Or can you just partially enclose them?

I have not reach that scenario yet, sounds like fun.

Maybe they did that so you can have wall enclosed 100% and still allow water to get inside.

Ancient Rome I watch from the bonus DVD would break the aqueducts under siege to keep invaders out; and relied upon huge underground water cisterns for storage to live on until the siege was over.

Update: It is true that the wall must enclose 100%.

For very high prosperity, try to make the largest percentage of population Patrician and Equates. It is calculated via percentage of population within that Class (along with the level of housing reached).

[bexgames]

I have not reach that scenario yet, sounds like fun.
This scenario is lots of fun for me, no military just barbarian invaders, but it's all about making money :)
For very high prosperity, try to make the largest percentage of population Patrician and Equates. It is calculated via percentage of population within that Class (along with the level of housing reached).
I have a very large percentage of those, but I guess I just need walls. I make lot's of money from exports, but they just suck it all up!! It's going to take a while before I can enclose the whole map with walls :eek: So, remember that when you get to Caralis..build the walls early, and open all trade routes early, 'cause you're going to need them!!

[Afro Thunder]

So, let me get this straight: you can build walls over aquaducts and the aquaducts will still pump water through them?

[bexgames]

yep, it worked for me. now, I don't know about crossing the aquaduct, if you can do that, I'll check that out, but you can build right on top :cool:

[vic_4]

yep, it worked for me. now, I don't know about crossing the aquaduct, if you can do that, I'll check that out, but you can build right on top :cool:
Yes you can cross walls with aqueducts.

[chazsi]

Bex, you are very funny.:p

I'm not there yet or I would do one of two things...

1).... offer you help

2).... say, "me too, bexy."

Good luck. when I have trouble here... I am going to PM you.:D

[The Sage Nabooru]

I'm beginning to think that this level cannot possibly be completed. It has to be done with means that are impossible given the extent of gameplay allowed. The closest I ever got to getting a 50 Prosperity rating was when I tore down every single last Insula I had and just let the domi and villi stay, but even then I couldn't win.

I've tried supplying enough entertainment as the villi demand, but I can't build anything larger than an arena. The demands that I completely enclose the city in walls in order to have Max Level domi pretty much took up any room I might have had to build more domi and villi. Building on farmland resulted in a lack of food for the citizenry.

The map is too small to supply everything I need to get an unreal 50 Prosperity rating.

If a solution doesn't come soon I may very well return the game if I can't complete this wreck of a level.

[ZiRo]

If a solution doesn't come soon I may very well return the game if I can't complete this wreck of a level.

Don't be so petty :) I'm sure it's completable. I'm not there yet - but i'll have to hurry up and have a go.

[Grumpus]

Cheer up Sage. It can be done! Post a recent saved game and we'll take a look at it for you.

[The Sage Nabooru]

How do I post a savegame? Can I use a photo-hosting service like Photobucket?

And I'm sorry if I sound sore, I've just been on this level since an hour after I got the game and this is about my third or fourth incarnation of it. And it's like Bexgames said - it just goes on and on and on and on and on and my Prosperity level stagnates at about 35.

[bexgames]

I posted this on another post:
*I first started that scenario as a small farming village, and when there was enough for trade I would place the ports. but, I bought them, and had them as soon as possible, just didn't place them yet. when the farming grows, make money that way, keep your population small. there'll be money in the bank then. where I messed up was when the money came in, I started building like crazy, and forgot the walls. So, I would suggest when you still have smallish town, put down walls, then build funds back up. Caralis is very time consuming. go slowly.*

It is possible to reach those levels sage, but you do have to have lot's of happy patricians and the equites to achieve it. It's the only way to raise your prosperity levels. I had all other levels sky high, except for that one.
you get lured into a false sense of security because you make so much money with exports, but your going to need it to make all those pats happy. There's no military need in this scenario, but you need to be map "savvy".
It is the only level I had to play over!!!

[Grumpus]

How do I post a savegame? Can I use a photo-hosting service like Photobucket?



When you start or post a reply to a thread, there is an area at the bottom of the screen called "additional options" (you might have to scroll down a bit to see it) There you will see a section to attach files.

1 - Press manage attachments button
2 - Browse to your C4 saved game folder
3 - Select game
4 - upload


Each level of housing from small insula to Grand Mansion has a certain number of prosperity points. The higher level, the more points. The most points you can get for an insula is about 25, and the most points you can get for a domus is about 35. So, if your prosperity goal is higher than about 30, you'll have to build elite housing. Generally speaking, you want to evolve your luxury housing as high as you can, while at the same time, reducing to an absolute miunimum the number of insula and domi.

Usually, having too many equites is the problem.

[silvrdark]

I'm glad to know I'm not the only one who is having trouble with this level - the highest I have gotten my prosperity level is 43. I think it would be easier if either there was more map room, or at least an importable source of food so I didn't have to grow so much. As things stand now, I'm going to have to knock down some things to enclose the city.

Actually, all the maps so far seem to be kind of small. I hope they get bigger.

[somnus]

I’m officially frustrated with this level.

1. I have a completely walled in city.
2. I have my first and second tier housing at the max level
3. There’s so little room on this map, I’m having some difficulty getting my highest level housing to the max level. (I have two, but not three types of entertainment available to my best houses)
4. My prosperity is stuck at around 38 or so.

The prosperity constraint is absurd on this level. I’ve played through 3 times, and I only get more frustrated each time. This is not fun. This is flat-out terrible level design. The arbitrary nature of what is grayed out (I can get timber, but I can’t make furniture) makes the whole thing even more annoying.

If I have to nuke my lower level housing, my industry is going to collapse, which will then mean I can’t make money from exports.

Okay, I’ve vented.

[Agamemnus]

I think this map is very difficult as well. You really need to be able to balance resources to meet the Emperor's demands as well build efficiently.

I started out by placing some plebian and equite housing north of the flat beach line. On the beach line you will be able to place several docks.

North of the pleb/equite housing, I set up my farms. North of that I set up most of my factories.

I placed a FEW factories at the beach... weapons/utensils on the east side, clay/glass/timber on the west. Don't be afraid to cut down re-generatable forests. You only need one small forest area, maybe equivalent to 5x5 of space.

My patrician houses and facilities were squeezed on the east side, just north of my docks and a few factories.

I placed two reservoir/pump systems: one, going straight from the sea, east of the patrician houses and the second, going straight, west of the pleb houses.

General tips:

* The really important first trade routes are the ones that only require plebs.
* Maintain a dependable supply of goods for your equites once they evolve to medium/large, as a sudden drop down could seriously unbalance your economy.
* Remember to try to keep your warehouses balanced and not full...

[Grumpus]

I’m officially frustrated with this level.

1. I have a completely walled in city.
2. I have my first and second tier housing at the max level
3. There’s so little room on this map, I’m having some difficulty getting my highest level housing to the max level. (I have two, but not three types of entertainment available to my best houses)
4. My prosperity is stuck at around 38 or so.

The prosperity constraint is absurd on this level. I’ve played through 3 times, and I only get more frustrated each time. This is not fun. This is flat-out terrible level design. The arbitrary nature of what is grayed out (I can get timber, but I can’t make furniture) makes the whole thing even more annoying.

If I have to nuke my lower level housing, my industry is going to collapse, which will then mean I can’t make money from exports.

Okay, I’ve vented.

Cheer up! It can be done!

Lots of elite housing is not necessary to get a prosperity rating of 50. What is important is the ratio of elite villas to equite/plebe houses.

I have just won this scenario with a prosperity rating of 53. I had:

10 Large Insula 6 Large Dormi 4 Medium Estates


Had I planned better I could have had another 4 Medium Estates which would have probably gotten me a prosperity rating of around 70 or so.

Get as much equite bang for the buck as you can. If you build an Odeum place it so that it serves all your housing. Same with other entertainment/educational/health/hygene facilities. Equite bloat is a prosperity killer!

Another thing: You only need a population oif 1500-2000 to staff all the facilities you need. You can feed this many people with 6-8 farms (12-16 fields). Therefore you can use a lot of the arable space for your city.

[Agamemnus]

Nice strategy there. Pretty minimalist. :eek: The trees are not bad though.

[bexgames]

I officially hate this level.
ok, my kids are tippy-toeing around me, and I want to throw something.
I love this game!!:D

[ZiRo]

I too have completed this map. I was going to use my first go as a tester because I was sure I'd fail.

I just have to disagree with grumpus's theory regarding ratio of villas:eq/pleb housing. I found that irrelevant - however villa prosperity average played a massive part for me. I actually won the map by DELETING an underevolved villa - it was keeping my average down and therefore I gained at least the final 4 prosperity points by deleting it. However that is just my experiance.

Oh - and I didn't use walls..

Strategy:
I basically started off selling pottery, then buying iron from the same dealer, selling utensils and weapons by trade.

I kept Equites to a minimum, never really were they unemployed.

The key to this map I found was establishing income, providing to rome, then evolving ~4 villas as much as possible (unevolved villas will hurt your prosperity rating).

Any tips I can offer:
- Don't worry about what you need to provide rome. I found it best to provide when they want it... wine, build wine, I didn't preplan it, I started my wine industry when rome wanted it, rather than pre-empt it. I was caught out by the request for clothes, I missed out by 1 unit under the 25 unit request - gutted. Perhaps stick a wool farm in, don't worry about making the clothes till they want them, unless you have plebs to spare.
- If you hit the sweet spot with the exports, you can afford ALOT. I was buying,deleting things that i didn't even need to. I could afford it.

My trade early on was so. I got clay via 4 camps, which went direct to 4/5 pottery facs, pottery direct to the port = $$. I imported iron at the same port = $$, going direct to the 4 weapons factory along with 3 woodcamps worth of timber, the weapons went direct to another port = $$$$. When I'd produced all I COULD sell in weapons, I mothballed them. To allow the remaining imported iron to be used by 3 utensils facs, to sell to africa via a port = $$$.

As you can see - early pottery trade paid for the iron, allowing me to make even more profit from weaponry.

My entire city ran by this system. I only have ~10 fields supporting a population of just over 2000. It kept saying I didn't have enough food - but i had enough to scrape through.

In the end I'd saved up ~7000dn and just upgraded the villas by providing everything - 3 exotic goods, clinics, entertainment, more religon etc.

Ignore the dn, I got into debt by "keep playing", though I was close to the redline ingame :)
Pic 1: my early industry
Pic 2: my houses and services
Pic 3: in depth of my late development area, villas, equites and services to upgrade the villas.
Pic 4: my rome industry and some of my trade - i used the far end of the map to do all romes dirty work.
Pic 5: my rows of industrial production buildings
Pic 6: score board - took me a few years :P But I did it.

[ZiRo]

BTW, Grumpus, great city. I'm going to have to adopt aspects of your city layout, especially with regard to services - exquisit, I can only dream of such a stable city - I feel I could leave this running for 3 hours without having it fall to peices..

Excellent stuff. It's almost perfect. And I want to steal it :(

[vic_4]

I don't like very much Caralis since it is really too cramped, I could win it with a different stategy: Ibegan immediately to export whatever but weapons. Then I built 5 villas and evolved as much as I could. I think my problem is I am an overbuilder so I like to have a lot of space.

[ZiRo]

I tried applying grumpus's layout to the next map - it's tough to find enough open space so I had to extend some roads to take unbuildable terrain into account.

It worked well, however I spotted another error in the way I deployed my city to the people - so next time i'll find a better build spot and correct my errors.

The next scenario seems interesting. Annoyingly has a military aspect to it - even though i supposedly chose the non-military one.

Excellent stuff though.

[Grumpus]

Thanks for your kind words about my city. Feel free to steal whatever.

Sorry, but prosperity ratings ARE determined by the ratio of levels of housing, and your saved city helped me to confirm this. You had evolved 3 villas to large estates, and I hadn't got that far yet.

In an earlier cb game (I think it was Emperor, but I'm not sure) there was a prosperity rating, and it was determined by a formula that gave each level of occupied housing "prosperity points" The higher level of housing, the more points it got. Then all the points for every level of housing was added up, and that number was divided by the number of occupied houses. The result was the prosperity rating (or whatever it was called in that game.)

In another forum, there was a player (I believe his moniker was Sajus) who discovered that this game had a similiar formula. Each level of housing has a prosperity value as follows:

Small Insula = 1
Medium Insula = 10
Large Insula = 25

Small Domus = 1
Medium Domus = 25
Large Domus = 35

Small Villa = 1
Medium Villa = 40
Large Villa = 60

Small Estate = 100
Medium Estate = 155
Large Estate = 220

(figures for Mansions not verified yet)

Small Mansion = 295
Medium Mansion = 390
Grand Mansion = 500



So I had

10 large insula = 10 x 25 = 250
6 large domus = 6 x 35 = 210
4 Medium Estate = 4 x 155 = 620

250 + 210 + 620 = 1080/20 total houses = 54

You had

10 large insula = 10 x 25 = 250
1 small domus = 1
9 medium domus = 9 x 25 = 225
1 Medium Estate = 155
3 Large Estates = 3 x 220 = 660

250 + 1 + 225 + 155 + 660 = 1291/24 houses = 54 (rounded up)

So if your prosperity goal is above 30 you just about have to start building enough Patrician housing to balance out the plebe/equite housing.

Again, I didn't come up with this. It was uncovered by Sajus(?),

[ZiRo]

Ok, that accounts for most things in my book.

I'll just stop suggesting how I think because it's usally wrong - and definatly avoid trying to disprove people like Grumpus, who've obviously got a much better grasp on the game than I.

[Agamemnus]

I want to post my city too!

My main strategy is to get as many (max. evolved) patrician housing units as possible, and completing objectives is just a side-effect..

[Pi-Xerxes]

I agree with Grumpus. I am glad someone went through the trouble to figure out all the numbers!

[vpsaline]

I think the reason its so difficult to pass this stage is because of a "possible" bug. Unless im overlooking something.

The bug on this map is that the player is always being penalized for weak entertainement. The game thinks you can build Coloseums and Circuses when in fact you cant. That gives your city a poor overall entertrainment appeal. Thats a really hard hurdle to overcome.

Check out the entertainement advisor tab to see this.

[Agamemnus]

That is always the case, though. Perhaps you just aren't centering your entertainment venues?

[Cipher]

Agamemnus, your SPQR hedges are hilarious, is that a governor's palace or the local radio station?:p

[vic_4]

I think the reason its so difficult to pass this stage is because of a "possible" bug. Unless im overlooking something.

The bug on this map is that the player is always being penalized for weak entertainement. The game thinks you can build Coloseums and Circuses when in fact you cant. That gives your city a poor overall entertrainment appeal. Thats a really hard hurdle to overcome.

Check out the entertainement advisor tab to see this.
You can win the scenario without circus and coliseum, it is only difficult for cramped space. The trick is to have every hose as evoluted as possible and as few plebs as you can. You can look my savegame attached earlier in this thread.

[bexgames]

On my third try, I finally won!! :D :D YAY!!!
I did it without walls, but for me it took alot of satisfying those darn patricians.
I had a patrician complaining about hygiene, with a fully functional bathouse right next door, and a hygenist making house calls to them! I think that's because no barbershop. I also had one complaining about entertainment, when it was surrounding him.. but no coliseum or circus. I think those things do hamper a bit, but it can be done. I also gave a couple Bacchus festivals which increase the patricians morale...

[ZiRo]

Your excitement will be short lived -there are similar scenarios involving prosperity that follow....

I dislike these prosperity rating ones - I take pride in making a functioning city, so i'd prefer a scenario that requires you to turn 5,000dn into 50,000dn

[vpsaline]

but for me it took alot of satisfying those darn patricians.
I had a patrician complaining about hygiene, with a fully functional bathouse right next door, and a hygenist making house calls to them! I think that's because no barbershop. I also had one complaining about entertainment, when it was surrounding him.. but no coliseum or circus. I think those things do hamper a bit, but it can be done.

Then if we are right, the citizen shouldnt complain about something which hasnt been unlocked yet (no barbershops, no circuses etc...).

BUG!!!

[vic_4]

Your excitement will be short lived -there are similar scenarios involving prosperity that follow....

I dislike these prosperity rating ones - I take pride in making a functioning city, so i'd prefer a scenario that requires you to turn 5,000dn into 50,000dn
When there is space around it is fun to get prosperity grow, moreover patrician houses are a boon for taxation and the more they evolve the more they pay.

[bexgames]

Your excitement will be short lived -there are similar scenarios involving prosperity that follow....
I dislike these prosperity rating ones - I take pride in making a functioning city, so i'd prefer a scenario that requires you to turn 5,000dn into 50,000dn
I agree I'd prefer cities that make money, or cities that require lot's of favor, you still have to work hard, but you see the fruits of your labor for everyone. Cities that require those high prosperity levels are all about the patricians, and that gets boring after awhile. I want to feel like a Caesar for all people, not just the spoiled elite.

[Agamemnus]

Agamemnus, your SPQR hedges are hilarious, is that a governor's palace or the local radio station?:p


:eek: :D

[Milo]

Okay... I guess I am brain dead from playing this for 2 days straight, but how am I going to get Equites and Patricians with no furniture? As someone else has already noted, there is no furniture factory and you cannot import it. I guess these people don't mind sitting on the floor.

So.... the barbiarians are going to come in waves... I don't need military... Just the few guys on the walls are going to keep them out? Is there anything in particular I need to be ready for this? Lots of towers???

I LOVE THIS GAME, too. Have had many of the crashing issues they are talking about in the tech threads, but finally found workarounds. Has been a great weekend!

[Agamemnus]

There are other luxuries besides furniture. :D

To fight the barbarians off you can produce weapons by importing iron. :)

[Anya]

I believe in bribery :D Just throw 1500 at them and they go away :D

[Hadrianus]

Just finished my Caralis too.

Mine is not very well planned.. rather built as required. It looks ugly but I managed to finish the scenario on my first try. I kept building building vilas and tried to upgrade them as high as possible.

I finished the scenario in about 18 game years... :(

[ZiRo]

Nice! I'll tell you what, this Gaul "Lugendenium" or somthing has been a nice break from the harder ones.

You have plenty of space and rome isn't that demanding - well, if you pick the tradable items to produce, rome wants those too, so you just have to manage keeping for yourself, trading for income and rome's demands.

I've completed it - well, I just need to send rome a gift to get my favour up, probably a naked barbarian to take Caesar's fancy.

[Duud]

I'm beginning to think that this level cannot possibly be completed. It has to be done with means that are impossible given the extent of gameplay allowed. The closest I ever got to getting a 50 Prosperity rating was when I tore down every single last Insula I had and just let the domi and villi stay, but even then I couldn't win.



I had the same problem - my prosperity reached 49 and nothing better, than it slowly crawled down. I keep up creating vilas, but nothing happened. Population got over 2.000 and still I couldn't beat the level.

Then I read about the "prosperity" factor in the "civilopedia" and started to demolish and rebuild my vilas, which started to evolve to the larger ones immediately. To my surprise, that was the only way I could find to raise my prosperity and then I could beat the level...

I still don't understand how prosperity works..

[Zamolxes]

I never build minimalist. i always go for the big hude splendor of as big of a city i can fit on map.
Big city= lots of workers= maximized trade= insane cash for patrician exotic goods=more INSANE cash
When i build, i live little space around map for walls. Also my start involves developing 2 centers. 1st center is plebeian/equite, workforce, while 2nd center is patrician obviously. Here are some pics from my caralis:
1st shot: the 2 centers-> note 9 large estates ;)
2nd shot: my factories/farm-> note the 2 forts in corner :D
3rd shot: financial balance in the year when i layed those mansions down, for next year the profits will be really impressive.

[vic_4]

I had the same problem - my prosperity reached 49 and nothing better, than it slowly crawled down. I keep up creating vilas, but nothing happened. Population got over 2.000 and still I couldn't beat the level.

Then I read about the "prosperity" factor in the "civilopedia" and started to demolish and rebuild my vilas, which started to evolve to the larger ones immediately. To my surprise, that was the only way I could find to raise my prosperity and then I could beat the level...

I still don't understand how prosperity works..
Prosperity is linked to your houses level:it is the sum of single houses prosperity devided by the number of houses.
Grumpus made an excellent overview at this link http://www.tiltedmill.com/forums/showthread.php?p=124059&highlight=prosperity#post124059

[Agamemnus]

Nice city, Zamolxes...

[Nimlot]

Finally managed to crack this one too :cool:

[chazsi]

I'm not there yet....

but you all have me yearning for the frustration.;)

I cannot wait to start this city.

I shall remember the name Caralis...Caralis...Caralis...

When I come back here and complain... you can all laugh.:D

[nexxa002]

Im sooo close to starting this over and yet I read all your posts and im thinking dont do it!!!!!!!!!! Im stuck as well and now in the process of tearing down only to make more room, only to run to low of funds, only to sell more, only to tear more down, to build more, to run out of funds omg!!!!!!!

Ok I feel better now and with all the examples that you kind ppl have set forth I just might be able to finish this city :p

Wish me luck fast teehee

[vic_4]

Im sooo close to starting this over and yet I read all your posts and im thinking dont do it!!!!!!!!!! Im stuck as well and now in the process of tearing down only to make more room, only to run to low of funds, only to sell more, only to tear more down, to build more, to run out of funds omg!!!!!!!

Ok I feel better now and with all the examples that you kind ppl have set forth I just might be able to finish this city :p

Wish me luck fast teehee
GOOD LUCK
But first of all enjoy!!!

[nexxa002]

Ahh thank you Vic,
Im back again for another night of trying to finish that city lol I worked on it again for over two hours getting to 43 prosperity and finally had to bag out for the WOW related South Park hehe *yes Im a WOW addict*
I think its only a matter of time now and maybe tonight will be that time of completion ... God I hope so lol

[Barbara]

I want to thank everyone in this thread most greatfully. This was a very hard city. The biggest challenge of course was the denarii. Space was not really an issue for me. My problem is that I want to layout the whole city in advance. You cannot do that with only 10K denarii.

So what I did was lay out the city all while paused. I used the cheat code for additional denarii so that I could plan everything in advance. Once I had the intial plan figured out I did a screen capture on my layout city and exited. I restarted the city from scratch and using the screen capture I was able to put down the road skeleton and the minimum number of buildings and houses necessary to start the city. Denarii is still extremely tight because of the expense of opening up the trade routes.

It took me close to five game years. The key was having this thread to warn me of all the pitfalls. I am very thankful for this forum and the members here.

[Keith]

I'm going to have to restart my Caralis. I've overbuilt the city so much that it can't feed itself adequately anymore. It's a really nice looking city of almost 7,000 people but it's just way too big and the prosperity rating isn't going up past 42. ;)

[C Franziskus]

I want to thank everyone in this thread most greatfully. This was a very hard city. The biggest challenge of course was the denarii. Space was not really an issue for me. My problem is that I want to layout the whole city in advance. You cannot do that with only 10K denarii.

So what I did was lay out the city all while paused. I used the cheat code for additional denarii so that I could plan everything in advance. Once I had the intial plan figured out I did a screen capture on my layout city and exited. I restarted the city from scratch and using the screen capture I was able to put down the road skeleton and the minimum number of buildings and houses necessary to start the city. Denarii is still extremely tight because of the expense of opening up the trade routes.

It took me close to five game years. The key was having this thread to warn me of all the pitfalls. I am very thankful for this forum and the members here.

Nice job Barbara,
looks like you little 'trick' seems to be working ...;) :)
gonna have to try that!

[bexgames]

I'm going to have to restart my Caralis. I've overbuilt the city so much that it can't feed itself adequately anymore. It's a really nice looking city of almost 7,000 people but it's just way too big and the prosperity rating isn't going up past 42. ;)
welcome to Caralis Hell. :D ;)

[Barbara]

Nice job Barbara,
looks like you little 'trick' seems to be working ...;) :)
gonna have to try that!

Thank you. I am getting a handle on efficiency. But I don't think my cities are pretty. They just work. The reservoir and the aquaduct are ugly. But if you don't plant the reservoir as close to the middle as possible you have reduced area for housing. I try to have one granary and one set of markets to service the housing. My problem is that I wasn't able to efficiently manage warehouses as I would like.

Question. Will industries draw goods directly from a trade port or do they only pull their goods from a warehouse? I was shooting for just 10 insula but I just couldn't eek it out. By the time I needed to staff my exotic market I just didn't have enough plebians. My factories were too far away from the action and I needed too many warehouses.

Another question? Does a Mercury Shrine help speed up the cart movers? What does it mean to have city-wide coverage? Does religion just need to cover the housing? Or, in the case of Mercury should I place those shrines near industry and the roads where the cart pushers will be?

[Agamemnus]

Thank you. I am getting a handle on efficiency. But I don't think my cities are pretty. They just work. The reservoir and the aquaduct are ugly. But if you don't plant the reservoir as close to the middle as possible you have reduced area for housing.
You can set up more than one reservoir, one at each side. I don't like placing the reservoir in the middle of the city myself as that is pretty much the most valuable space.


Question. Will industries draw goods directly from a trade port or do they only pull their goods from a warehouse?

I think they will take goods directly from the trade port.


I was shooting for just 10 insula but I just couldn't eek it out. By the time I needed to staff my exotic market I just didn't have enough plebians. My factories were too far away from the action and I needed too many warehouses.

Only a few warehouses will suffice for even far away industry. Just set up the warehouses that are next to the factories to hold low amounts of goods so that they keep getting moved up.


Another question? Does a Mercury Shrine help speed up the cart movers?

No.


What does it mean to have city-wide coverage? Does religion just need to cover the housing? Or, in the case of Mercury should I place those shrines near industry and the roads where the cart pushers will be?

It just needs to cover the housing; pleb, equite, and patrician housing that is.

[Grumpus]

Barbara:

Suggest you put your factories producing luxury and basic goods in or near your city. They are quite capable of getting the materials they need even if they have to travel a great distance to do so.(provided that they are connected) The markets will then pick up goods directly from the factories.

Let's say that you have two woodcutters supplying four furniture factories, and that the woodcutters are some distance from the city. Put the factories and the trade depot in or near the city. Then put one warehouse dedicated to timber out near the wood camps. The warehouse gets timber from the camps. The factories get timber from the warehouse. The trade depot and the markets get furniture from the factories.

[Zamolxes]

I actually have a successfull housing design with reservoir at the very center of the city.And saves a LOT of headache!
There goes my secret: the magic square by Zamolxes:
If u have a bit of room, and generally u do, every single map i played so far it did, u build a square. So big that u can fit 4 domuses on each side of this square: picture 1.

Now that u have that square, u extend the each side by exactly 1 lenght on insulae, like so: picture 2

U end up with a flower...of sorts. Now in the center of the whole thing u put a reservoir, like this. Make sure the connection points of the reservoir line up with the little spaces u left between insuales! Put in the aqueduct line that will take u to the closest water pump. picture 3

Now in the 4 corners of main square, on inside, put a bathhouse, odeum, hospital, and leave room for a libray, like so (i added it up for exemplification's sake, save the spot till u actually have the denarii and manpower):
picture 4

In the corners of same square, on outside though, add 2 food markets, basic good, luxury good, school and clinic, 2 warehouses and 1 granary, like so (save spots for school and clinic, warehouses and granary for later):
picture 5

Set the warehouses to get the goods corespondednt to closest market. Now, starting from 1 corner of interior square, add 4 fountains, then 4 prefectures, then 4 engineers, like so:
picture 6

Fill in with roads, temples, trees and hedgerows to your heart content! Dont forget the TAX OFFICE!!!
picture 7

Now u have the basic layout of your WORKFORCE center, that can support, if u add in the rest of insulaes and domuses, well over 6000 workers if not more, when fully evolved, ON MINIUMUM SPACE!!!. Hints: u can get away only with 1 food market, but after u build city walls, a 2nd one is good to have. On the exterior edge, beyond those insulaes, u can create a 2nd square of insulaes, or just PRETTY, make sure u leave room!!!:
picture 8

After all this is done, u should have around 5k denarii left to build up your food and production facilities, aprox 1/2 of your trade output.
Always make sure u supply insuales with 2 basic goods 1st, so they can evolve to max level. By the time u run out of cash, and u left with 500-1000 denarii, u should have at least 1 trade center exporting, all people fed, and 2 basic goods supplied.
Enjoy! U're now the proud owner of Roman Square ;)

[Barbara]

Barbara:

Suggest you put your factories producing luxury and basic goods in or near your city. They are quite capable of getting the materials they need even if they have to travel a great distance to do so.(provided that they are connected) The markets will then pick up goods directly from the factories.



Thank you, Grumpus! I didn't know that the markets will retrieve directly from the factory. That will save me some on wharehouses. :)



You can set up more than one reservoir, one at each side. I don't like placing the reservoir in the middle of the city myself as that is pretty much the most valuable space.



Yeah. But that would take 24 more equite employees. :D Talk about cheap.

[Agamemnus]

Zamolxes: I guess that works, but that does not allow space for a theater or an arena. What about the temple access... does it go to all the roads?

[Zamolxes]

Yep. And workers dont need arena, nor theather. And usually 5 small shrines to all those workers seems to be more than enuff. Besides, u have so much room leftover in the corners to add whatever u feel like u need! Entertainment, security, health, etc etc etc like so:
That's 48 insulaes and 16 domuses, for a grand total of: 48x150+16x80=7200+1280=8480 people!!!

[Barbara]

Wow! Kudos on the Roman Square, Z. Fantastic plan. :)

[bexgames]

Wow! that'll come in handy! Thanks :cool:

[cerulean blue]

I'm glad to know I'm not the only one who is having trouble with this level - the highest I have gotten my prosperity level is 43. I think it would be easier if either there was more map room, or at least an importable source of food so I didn't have to grow so much. As things stand now, I'm going to have to knock down some things to enclose the city.

Actually, all the maps so far seem to be kind of small. I hope they get bigger.
Well i have tons of trouble with this level, especially since i cant seem to please Rome and my ppl all at once, but as far as walls go, i build them first. right around the city..with the resevoirs right by them...ofcourse i also had to give myself 100,000 dn to start..even that doesnt appear to be enough..

anyway, i officially suck at this level....but im gonna keep at it...i sucked at Narbo too, but i made it through...:)

[Keith]

The attack always comes from one of two locations so those are the areas you should wall first. The one attack comes from the upper left corner as you look at the city from the water, and the other comes from about the middle upper edge of the map from the same viewing point.

You don't have to get the wall up all the way first. Just having walls and towers there will help. Each tower puts out a small group of bowmen guards. So I try to put a tower at evenly spaced intervals. Seem my screenshots.

Also, note to make the tower work all you have to do is put one patch of road by it. That patch does not have to be connected back to your city, seem my overhead screenshots.

I usually start out with about 8 insulae and small handful of equites to get my industry going and to get my trade and other services like clinics and water system running to encourage them to evolve.

[ezri47]

Finally I finished, thanks everyone for the tips.

First time round I spent about 10 hours trying to get my prosperity up! Drove me balmy. Then I read a few hints here and that helped.

I had about 1600 people, no walls (my domus's wanted them but they weren't getting them!), built my villas and kept them deprived of exotic goods until I was ready to enable my extra entertainment and education options. I exported pottery, weapons and wine only, and imported iron, perfume and salt (stockpiled the exotics but had them ready)

I kept things mothballed that I didn't need, to save needing extra lower level housing which would affect my prosperity.

Excellent, now to move on, this scenario was sooo frustrating.

[vic_4]

Yes, it is really frustrating, but it teaches a lot about city planning.

[Zamolxes]

Wait till u get to 1st mission in empire campaign: jagged terrain, full with trees, that u have to cut down at some point to make room for buildings,AH! a nightmare.
I'm looking at the map since this morning, 10 hours ago, i havent started yet to lay 1 piece of road yet LOL.

[bexgames]

I'm looking at the map since this morning, 10 hours ago, i havent started yet to lay 1 piece of road yet LOL.
ROFL...I thought I was the only one who did that...have done it a couple of times...now, where the heck do I start???:eek:
plebs here, patricians can later come here, with their little entertainment corner over there..no wait, plebs here...