CotN keeps crashing NOT solved

For any technical or performance issues
Jytte
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CotN keeps crashing NOT solved

Postby Jytte » Fri Jan 18, 2019 8:22 pm

I started a post in Editor here: viewtopic.php?f=20&t=30084

Turns out this is more complicated, after so many uninstall and reinstalls I've lost count, and hundreds of tests, this is the situation:

I make a new scn, empty map, go to make a world level... I can do anything I want, EXCEPT put a site on coordinates 365-370...
I'd made a world level with a fort on exactly that position, kept crashing. After redoing that map in various versions, same result.
Atatnall was kind enough to test my files also, and in her game every map I made is A OK, just won't run on mine.

So, I figured something during a crash (and we get those aplenty with CotN) must have 'stuck' somewhere. I uninstalled yet again, went into registry via regedit and removed any and all things remotely connected to CotN. Complete restart and reinstall. I should add here, that when I uninstall, I also remove all files associated with CotN.

Does not seem to matter what I do, or how many times I do it. Putting a site on those coordinates will crash the world level (while that same file works just fine for another user).

I suppose I can get around it by just staying away from that position, at least testing seems to show that to be the case. But something's obviously wrong, and I'd dearly love to fix it. I'm just completely our of ideas as to how???

Any smart people out there with any bright ideas on what I try next?
Last edited by Jytte on Tue Jan 29, 2019 10:59 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Jytte (alias Ubekhet)

RJG
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Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby RJG » Sat Jan 19, 2019 12:15 pm

Hi Jytte, My guess is somewhere on your PC you still have a file or files that when you uninstall the game, it is not removing everything. Something keeps telling your fresh installs to error on 365-370. You proved that when your scenario worked on Atatnall’s system. As far as I know, COTN does not do any configuring of the game in the registry, so that’s out. At least looking at mine it doesn’t.

I would recheck where your game installs. I download my game from Steam so my game install is under C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Children of the Nile Alexandria. Also it makes a directory “Tilted Mill” under my user name, documents. These folders contain my game configuration, any scenarios I have made, Campaigns, Snapshots, etc.

Now I know when I uninstall COTN, any custom files I may have added into those default folders, under C:\Program Files (x86)\Steam\steamapps\common\Children of the Nile Alexandria, they do not get removed when you uninstall. You have to manually remove them. Same is true for the directory under my user name documents. You have to manually remove these files and folders also.

As I said earlier, somewhere on your system, something is not being removed causing that error. I know how frustrating this can be.
Hopefully, something I suggested helps you locate the problem. I am sure you don’t want to reinstall Windows.

Good luck finding it…RjG

Jytte
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Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby Jytte » Sat Jan 19, 2019 2:34 pm

Hi RjG, thanks for answering,
I just did a complete uninstall and cleanup again. Meaning there are NO files left anywhere, nor any folders to do with CotN, nothing. Then I checked the registry, no entries. Then I completely deleted any and all things in temp in appdata. That really should clean out everything.
Shut down. Opened, check that all other programs are working. Shut down.
Reopen. Now, last night I downloaded a fresh copy of the game from GOG. I then install that.
I open Abu (original small game), make a copy of Abu, make another copy of that just to be on the safe side.
I open my new copy. Go to world level. Move a few things around, fine... Now, moving things around I simply do by entering a new coordinate, then replace. I do things REAL slow and steady. This is simple stuff that we do all the time when setting up a new world level.
So move things around. Then move an enemy camp they have in there to the famed 365-370, fine, saving in between with a new file. Then rename that as Ibscheck (why would it matter?), then changing it to an enemy fort, so far so good. I changed 'our city' to a fortress (friendly) and renamed it Baki. Then I went to move it, BOOOM

None of this makes any sense. And I'm a nervous wreck by now, it's like working with a mined keyboard, you never know when it's gonna blow.

Yesterday I opened our laptop. Installed CotN, from the old copy, the copy that's been working for me since years. Tried a few things, seemed ok. Then opened the file I got back from Atatnall, moved an enemy fort to 365-370, BOOM. ????????? So much for something hanging in MY computer.

This with 365-370 isn't holding water either. Yesterday, still on the old copy of game, but a fresh install, I just opened a new world level put in THREE sites, our and a city and a friendly fort, moved the fort to 350-350, BOOM It's like it gets worse.

No, I don't have a virus, double check with 2 different very good programs, nothing.

I did not install ANY new programs recently, or for a very long time for that matter.

After all this started happening, 3-4 days ago by now, I was working on the map itself, entering some messages in effects, quite a lot actually, that goes without a hitch. Opening or working on a world level on the other hand seems a thing of the impossible.

What did I DO??

Did I offend some God of Kemet? Am I now cursed?

There HAS to be a reason for this, but I can't for the life of me figure out what it is.
Jytte (alias Ubekhet)

Jytte
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Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby Jytte » Sat Jan 19, 2019 4:34 pm

Did another complete uninstall, this time with an uninstaller program, complete cleanout, nothing left anywhere. Shutdowns etc.
Installed again.
Made a copy of Abu, moved the enemy camp around a bit, CRASH

I have no idea what's going on, but it just won't let me do anything.
Jytte (alias Ubekhet)

RJG
Posts: 87
Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2009 6:38 pm

Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby RJG » Sat Jan 19, 2019 4:57 pm

Hi Jytte,
Well it sure looks like you have covered all the bases. Being that you got the same results on your laptop pretty much excludes your system but, it still could be other things on both systems causing this problem. I only say that because you say Atatnall tested your scenario and it worked fine. Well if it works for Atatnail and not you….1. Your systems have the problem or, 2. Atatnail gets their download from someone besides GOG, or 3. GOG has a corrupt download. Do we know if Atatnail gets COTN from GOG? When you have something as odd as this going on, you can’t rule out anything until you find the answer.

Check out the GOG link below under stability issues. Just maybe something there may solve this mystery. Could it be a graphics issue? Hey, you never know.

https://support.gog.com/hc/en-us/articl ... e-Complete

If you want I could try and duplicate what you are doing and see if I get the same results. List the steps in the same order and I will see what happens. My game comes from Steam. If I get the same issue duplicating your steps, then it would have to be the game itself. If I don’t, then either it is a corrupt download from GOG or a system issue.

Good Luck…..RjG

atatnall
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Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby atatnall » Sat Jan 19, 2019 5:25 pm

Indeed, I get my download through Steam.

RJG
Posts: 87
Joined: Wed Dec 09, 2009 6:38 pm

Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby RJG » Sat Jan 19, 2019 5:47 pm

Hi Jytte,

I just had a thought. Are you building this scenario using custom files or a custom map? If you are, try recreating this problem without using them. Just create a new game using the games defaults, no custom files or map and see if you get the same thing.

RjG
Last edited by RJG on Sat Jan 19, 2019 6:16 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Jytte
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Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby Jytte » Sat Jan 19, 2019 5:56 pm

Everything points to something 'stuck' in my computer. Both because Atatnall used the file with no problems, and because what I've been doing is nothing I haven't done a million times before, plus it's as simple as opening an existing game and asking it to move a site somewhere, not complicated in any way.
I do have the GOG file, and I find it hard to blame that, because it's the same file I've installed several times before (on PC change), with no problems. The latest install was on my PC for about 2 years before this.
It's tempting of course to try a steam version, but, apart from having to pay for the game again (and it's not the cheap price that bothers me, it's the principle) it's mostly because I understand you have to actually 'log in' to steam to play, and I do not like that.

I'm not hanging too much on the crashed install on the laptop, because it is unstable at best, hasn't been in use for a while. Anything that happens on that one I'm not trusting.

What prompted the first crash is likely my own being too fast on the trigger that happens often enough. Something must have then happened during that. Now I'm thinking (hoping) that I might have missed some step during the recent installs, something that I did differently those years ago?

I will do some research on the GOG site (thanks) and try again (and again). And will report back.
Jytte (alias Ubekhet)

Jytte
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Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby Jytte » Sat Jan 19, 2019 5:59 pm

I just had a thought. Are you building this scenario using custom files or a custom map? If you are, try recreating this problem without using them. Just created a new game using the games defaults, no custom files or map and see if you get the same thing


I was indeed, the file Atatnall had was on a custom map. However, I gave that up early on, and everything I've been doing is either in copies of perfectly functioning existing games, or a new file only with the original wl_map_1_1, so it is not a map, oh if it was only that simple...
Jytte (alias Ubekhet)

Jytte
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Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby Jytte » Sat Jan 19, 2019 7:18 pm

This time I reinstalled DirectX first.
Then installed CotN as normal.
Crashing
(shutdowns etc in between)
Installed CotN as compatible with windows 7.
Crashing

I cannot think what else could be going on.

After the last few installs, I tested playing Abu for a bit, tested entering some bogus triggers, no problem.
But as soon as I start touching a world level, crashing.
It all makes no sense.
Jytte (alias Ubekhet)

Jytte
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Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby Jytte » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:15 am

Just an update...
Turns out, CotN crashing was the least of my problems. This continued to a point where booting was no longer possible. Just had the PC-ambulance here, and my computer is now in the hospital :( Hard drive mbr is history.
Was this the cause of the CotN problem? Not sure.
Jytte (alias Ubekhet)

Keith
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Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby Keith » Thu Jan 24, 2019 8:22 pm

Jytte wrote:Just an update...
Turns out, CotN crashing was the least of my problems. This continued to a point where booting was no longer possible. Just had the PC-ambulance here, and my computer is now in the hospital :( Hard drive mbr is history.
Was this the cause of the CotN problem? Not sure.


If you have your computer back by now you may have an answer already, but a faulty hard drive could be the problem for sure.

Jytte
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Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby Jytte » Thu Jan 24, 2019 8:32 pm

I just got my PC back a few hours ago, with a brand new SSD drive for win and important software, new Win 10 installed.
I do imagine (hope) that the crashing drive was the cause of my CotN trouble, but first I must get all my business software up and running again, before I can get to checking on this. Having an almost 'virgin' PC is nice enough, but what a drag getting all your software set up again :(
Jytte (alias Ubekhet)

Jytte
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Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby Jytte » Fri Jan 25, 2019 10:57 pm

Geeez... I got my PC back yesterday, spent the past 30 hours (minus some sleep) getting all my important software back up and running. That is always a long process after a new install.
So install CotN... now it won't even start up :shock:
Checked all settings, can't see any problems.. Have the latest drivers, DirectX 12 and so forth.
And yes, I tried all the usual things like running as admin..or not.. uninstall, reinstall, installing on each drive (there are 2).. to no avail.
Of course, the repair shop that installed my new drive is now closed until Monday, and I'm left to go crazy over the weekend.

Anybody have ANY bright ideas??
Jytte (alias Ubekhet)

Jytte
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Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby Jytte » Sat Jan 26, 2019 3:53 pm

So, sent a full report and a diag to the Gog support team.... now getting an answer can take some time I imagine.

In the meantime, I dug out an old XP machine that has been collecting dust in a corner for over 3 years.

With the help from some people on the Gog forum, got it to run directX correctly, and I could open the CotN game I had just installed.

And THEN I did my usual test... and it CRASHED!

This is exactly what I did:

Open Abu (the original game in there) in editor
Save a copy of it
Pick the 'Nubian Main Column'
make it visible, replace
make it an 'enemy fort', replace
move it to 365-370, replace
save another new copy
move Nubian to x400, replace
move Nubian to x300, replace
move Nubian back to x365, replace
save yet another copy
moving fine limestone somewhere to the left..... BOOM (crash to desktop)

And THAT is exactly what CotN has been doing on multiple computers in this house since around the 16th of January. With the exact same result. The amount of things I can move before it crashes vary, but IT WILL CRASH as soon as I put an enemy site on 365-370, and then try to move things.

There is nothing out of the ordinary in what I did above, or what I've been doing so far in testing.... all perfectly normal procedures, and still it crashes, on 2 separate Win 10 1803 fully updated, on a Win 10 1709 not updated laptop, and now on an old XP.

PLEASE somebody tell me I'm not completely bonkers !

And Please Please... can somebody try exactly what I did (maybe a few more moves of things if needed) to see what happens for somebody else?
Jytte (alias Ubekhet)

RJG
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Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby RJG » Sat Jan 26, 2019 6:53 pm

Hi Jytte,

I tested exactly what you are trying to do on my system and it had no issues.

Jytte
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Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby Jytte » Sat Jan 26, 2019 7:18 pm

Thanks RJG, that's what I was waiting to hear.
This makes it even more senseless.
As I recall, you're on steam?

Meanwhile I downloaded a brand new install file from Gog, put it on my brand new virgin c-drive, copied it to a brand new usb stick.
I had cleaned out the XP also. Installed this brand new copy of the game on the XP. Fine
Went into play Abu for some years, no problem
Went into Editor, made a copy of Aby, and another copy of that, and started testing again.
Started scooting Limestone, fine limestone, serabit, maghara and Genubath sideways, to 500, to 600, to 500 and so forth. Fine
Saving a new copy and exiting in between as I go along.
Entered a bunch of triggers, no problem.
Moved friendlies around again, no problem.
Did this for a while, mind you, I do this very slowly and carefully.
yet another copy.
Picked up the Nubian Main Column, made it visible (also took off the spawn), replace
Moved it to 300-300, replace, save, new copy
Scooted the friendlies back and forth, no problems.
Saved a new copy.
THEN, I moved Nubian Main (not made a fort, not renamed or anything) to 365-370
went to move a friendly... CRASH !

???????????? I go nuts !!!!!

Still haven't heard from Gog-support and don't suppose I will since it's weekend.

There just HAS to be something wrong with that game, the copy from GOG that is, no other explanation. I've made cleanups, new downloads, new installs and hundreds of tests on FOUR different machines, ALL with the exact same result.

How could I spend over 3 years playing this game, making at least 10 scenarios, without having a problem? Well, I must assume that it's because I never put a site on 365-370 or close to that, enemy or otherwise. I write my scenarios outside CotN first in a file, and then enter it to CotN. I have those files, and painstakingly checked each one of them.
What other conclusion can be drawn from this???

I guess I find out how to get the steam game now, much as dislike the setup with online logins and what not.
Jytte (alias Ubekhet)

Jytte
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Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby Jytte » Sat Jan 26, 2019 7:49 pm

Problems is now, CotN refused to open after the install on my new (remade) PC. I tried a few times.
I completely uninstalled. Now, CotN does not leave anything in Registry, windows does!
I have several flags now in Registry concerning CotN.

This from my DxDiag:
Windows Error Reporting:
+++ WER0 +++:
Fault bucket 329806528, type 5
Event Name: BEX
Response: Not available
Cab Id: 0

Problem signature:
P1: CotN.exe
P2: 2.0.1.6
P3: 48a999f6
P4: CotN.exe
P5: 2.0.1.6
P6: 48a999f6
P7: 0040f4fc
P8: c000000d
P9: 00000000
P10:
There are 9 of those.
I don't know much about what goes on in there. But I'm thinking that this might negate me installing a proper copy ?
Jytte (alias Ubekhet)

atatnall
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Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby atatnall » Sat Jan 26, 2019 9:10 pm

Ok, I just did all the steps in Abu and had no trouble.

Jytte
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Re: CotN keeps crashing

Postby Jytte » Sat Jan 26, 2019 9:44 pm

Thanks Atatnall, now I'm juts left wondering if I can and want to go on Steam.
Jytte (alias Ubekhet)


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