What I would like to see in Caesar V

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Agamemnus
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What I would like to see in Caesar V

Postby Agamemnus » Thu Apr 30, 2009 4:44 pm

Been a while since Caesar IV.... here are my thoughts on what I'd like in another Roman city builder sim by TM.

I want to raise and lower terrain on a grid and in steps so I don't have to worry about not being able to build a building because of a few missing inches of space. I want the ability to bulldoze rocks that I don't like and add new rocks.

I want a lot more variety in campaigns and campaign objectives. For instance, how about a campaign with missions that don't need any city building at all -- just military squad management?

To go with the above, I want more control and more precision in my military: better unit formation control, behaviors, and squad movement control. I want to be able to envelop the enemy like Hannibal did at Cannae and Scipio did at Zama, instead of moving my troops around and having to re-order them multiple times like they were drunken idiots!

I want the Zeus ally/enemy/subject/colony dynamic back but perhaps without the "fake" resources from my colonies. Show it like it is!

I want to be able to switch cities mid-scenario at a whim so I can go back to a colony or parent city and buff up their resource production.

It seems to be a city builder trend nowadays to keep reducing the amount of buildings that a player can build--argh! I want more more residence levels and just more buildings that do different stuff. I want to say "this is MY city", not "this is generic city 743129"!

I want more refined control of scenario/campaign editing: more complete and streamlined modification of game variables and more thorough script control -- Caesar IV scenario design could be a lot better were it not for insufficient built-in triggers and conditions.

I want to be able to see my city from the perspective (eyes) of a resident, letting him/her do their job, or walk around as myself! (the ruler) TM should salivate of the possibilities this could open up -- think RPG (with a storyline!) tie-in, or RPG/city-building expansion! Heck, why not make the entire regular campaign on the premise of you as an actual person walking around the city and talking with other important figures as to what your scenario objectives are! Perhaps you can even replay your or (others fans'!) cities as a trader, mercenary, assassin, or spy!

Amun Nefer
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Postby Amun Nefer » Thu Apr 30, 2009 4:57 pm

Well this should probably go in the C4 forum, since the game's rights are still owned by Vivendi.

It's called a double envelopment (or pincer). To do a proper pincer you need to have your enemy laid out in the right way as well. At Cannae the Romans were in a solid block. You can also accomplish it through proper coaxing. The key thing though is to lay out your troops in an inverted V and the fake a retreat and turn the inverted V into a U. Bring your soldiers around to the flanks, and finally have your cavalry (which should be on the wings of your battle line) ride around to the enemy's rear. After that there's no way to counter. The rest is just closing in and slaughtering. :D

Good suggestions though. I like the ground-level view especially. :)

Keith
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Postby Keith » Thu Apr 30, 2009 5:56 pm

I would love to see another evolutionary step in the Caesar citybuilding line....but I think the chances of that are slim.

Some of those points listed above have been discussed before while we were all waiting for Caesar IV, such as terrain modification.

I gave up making scenarios after Pharaoh. A full editor that didn't require a huge amount of time and a Phd. to figure out would be nice. It would be great if they would fully support it too instead of offering it as a AS-IS tool.

I've said it before, if this is a "citybuilder' let me "build"! I would like more housing levels and building types. In particular, I want to build things like the colosseum, aquaducts, pantheon, the different versions (both wood and stone) of the great circus. I'd even like to see road construction and military stockade building, and to build Hadrian's Wall and all the military camps.

Even though Rome did not have a naval oriented military, they did have a navy and I would finally like to see to see a good model of ancient naval warfare included. Something with nice graphics, weapons, tactics and the commands to control it all. Let's do it right and not just pay lip service to it with some generic representation.

I would love to once again see and control battles like those in Caesar II, or, use Rome Total War as a guide.
Last edited by Keith on Thu Apr 30, 2009 6:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

pcgamer2
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Postby pcgamer2 » Fri May 01, 2009 4:47 am

perhaps tilted mill can start their own series of roman city building, or perhaps can try greek, either.Independently, they can have full control of what happens, not so much of a "complete the following tasks by this date* like what EA has pretty much done.But, i still think they should attempt to get Vivendi to let them make Caesar V as for marketing it would do much better.Again i havn't been too much into TM games lately since of WoW is usually the choice for me to go on free time, until im starting to get back into SCS now with windows back on, and then ill try to play hinterland (bought it but only played couple of hours, and silly me i lost my CIV disk and i need to tear apart my whole room to find it unless it fell into the trash by accy :eek:

Keith
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Postby Keith » Fri May 01, 2009 6:14 am

"pcgamer2" wrote:perhaps tilted mill can start their own series of roman city building, or perhaps can try greek, either.Independently, they can have full control of what happens,


Yes, I agree. Hopefully, they can develop something in the near future. Whatever it is, I hope it's not another downloadable game or a browser game.

Jacquou Le
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Postby Jacquou Le » Fri May 01, 2009 8:59 am

"Keith" wrote:Yes, I agree. Hopefully, they can develop something in the near future. Whatever it is, I hope it's not another downloadable game or a browser game.


I also agree. And I don't care what name they take. I'm still OK if the game uses Roman civilization but the name is somewhat like: 1001 Nights in Bagdad :D

Who cares the name? I don't :p

Czech Centurian
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Postby Czech Centurian » Fri May 01, 2009 4:13 pm

Actually I think a name is very important. It's what draws people in, the first thing they read or hear.

Keith
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Postby Keith » Fri May 01, 2009 8:37 pm

Unless TM aquires the rights to the name of the game, it's probably not possible for them to name any future game "Caesar V". However, that doesn't mean that can't name it something very similar. A "Caesar V" would have instant recognition but it's probably not feasible.

TM would probably want their own title to differentiate it's game from the previous line. Especially, if TM decides to take a different tack in the design of the game as they did with "Children of the Nile".

Tinkerbell
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Postby Tinkerbell » Fri May 01, 2009 8:52 pm

I am so sick & tired of Rome...

Amun Nefer
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Postby Amun Nefer » Fri May 01, 2009 9:16 pm

Augustus then! :D

I actually like the idea in Ikariam of some incorporation of steampunk into the units. Have Roman theme but with the idea of what it would have looked like if Hero of Alexandria had combined his knowledge of steam with his knowledge of pistons. :D An ancient steam-powered empire!

Agamemnus
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Postby Agamemnus » Fri May 01, 2009 11:34 pm

"Amun Nefer" wrote:Augustus then! :D

I actually like the idea in Ikariam of some incorporation of steampunk into the units. Have Roman theme but with the idea of what it would have looked like if Hero of Alexandria had combined his knowledge of steam with his knowledge of pistons. :D An ancient steam-powered empire!


Ok, but after they get everything else. We don't want to sidetrack TM so much that they don't make my precious terrain editing!.. :eek:

Amun Nefer
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Postby Amun Nefer » Fri May 01, 2009 11:47 pm

You can have your terrain editting as long as I have my steam-powered triremes. :D

Think of what you see from the Vinci in Rise of Legends. The Steampunk in that was the main reason I bought it. :D

(overuse of the :D smiley ^^)

Agamemnus
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Postby Agamemnus » Sun May 03, 2009 10:57 pm

"Amun Nefer" wrote:You can have your terrain editting as long as I have my steam-powered triremes. :D

Think of what you see from the Vinci in Rise of Legends. The Steampunk in that was the main reason I bought it. :D

(overuse of the :D smiley ^^)


Ya, well.... they concentrated on steampunk so much that they had a seriously broken multiplayer system, lackluster scenario editor system (so many possibilities--lots of possible XML changes, but it just wasn't done right..), a tiny player base, and no expansions.

The graphics DID rock, though.

Amun Nefer
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Postby Amun Nefer » Sun May 03, 2009 11:08 pm

I don't really play MP so much, so I wouldn't really know.

Yes, very awesome. :D

Timhotep
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Postby Timhotep » Fri May 08, 2009 6:03 pm

No more Rome, please!

Agamemnus
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Postby Agamemnus » Sun May 10, 2009 6:03 am

"Timhotep" wrote:No more Rome, please!


Hmm, your avatar is a Caesar avatar isn't it... ;)


Honestly, though there have been a lot of Rome city builders lately (past 3 yrs), the changes I am proposing (especially the last one) would add a whole new dimension that no one has ever done before. Of course, it could be done with a different civilization, but if it is to be a 3D city-builder/RPG, then if the RPG part is "Asian" or "space" or "modern", there have been a lot of RPGs in those eras/themes. Not so much precisely 3D Roman RPG, or even ancient (realistic, not total fantasy) RPG.
Last edited by Agamemnus on Sun May 10, 2009 6:08 am, edited 1 time in total.

Amun Nefer
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Postby Amun Nefer » Sun May 10, 2009 6:09 am

Lol, come on Aga does that look like a C4 avie? That's COTN-Wino. You should be able to tell from the way he's dressed and his skin colour that he is not a Roman.

You sure NO ONE else had thought of it before?

Agamemnus
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Postby Agamemnus » Sun May 10, 2009 4:02 pm

Oof, my bad.

You should be able to tell from the way he's dressed and his skin colour that he is not a Roman.

Well, not all Romans wore togas or were white. In fact, for Roman males, it was considered "pretty" to be tanned (how can you be sure he's not just tanned? :P ) back in those days. :\


Anyway, did anyone think of it? Maybe. Did it? Nope!
Last edited by Agamemnus on Sun May 10, 2009 4:10 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Salim
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Postby Salim » Thu May 14, 2009 5:35 pm

What I would like to see in Caesar V :
1- a friendly and easer map and campaing editor.
2- They could do the sistem lik in Tropico, where people have desires bars,in red- low, green-high, for exemple. they go to see an espetacle in Colisseum, afther finished, the fnny bar is high-green.
3-some aspects of Caesar II returned:
a- Provincial Level, Imperial Level.
b- battles in the provincial level.
4- arquitetal projects: Coliseums, Theatres or Anphitheatres build for exemple: 1000 habts. 2000 habts. or 5.000 habts.
Last edited by Salim on Thu May 14, 2009 5:40 pm, edited 1 time in total.

mad_genius
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Postby mad_genius » Sun May 17, 2009 11:19 am

What I would like to see in Caesar V?

1 - I would like to see the only thing that I liked about CivCity: Rome and that's the ability to build shops on the ground floor of insulae;

2 - I would like to have a social system like the one of CotN where you have social classes and people progress in live and climb up the social ladder from villager to peasant, to equite, to patrician. Each family should have their economic statistics. That way the owner of a shop placed bellow an insulae could buy the ground floor of the insulae next door in order to expand his shop to increase output.

3 - I would like to have and intelligent building system. Let me explain:

- if you notice on C4, when an insulae evolves the software takes into acount the roads that are alongside the building. When you have a medium or high insulae they get their ground floor filled with marble columns to make some sort of entrance hall, but the game doesn't simply draw those columns all around the building. I noticed this because one day I was building a city and I had an insulae placed on a corner next to a road crossing, the other 2 sides of the building didn't had a road next to them. On one of those sides there was another insulae and on the other I had placed a garden. I was expecting the house to evolve and get these columns all around it but I noticed that on the side of the house next to the garden appeared a normal wall instead of the columns. Imagine that concept applied to the roofs for example. That way you could fill a rectangular shaped space with insulaes with roads around them to create the illusion of a single giant insulae appartment. Imagine that applied not only to roads but to gardens as well, the insulae would put a front entrance with marble columns and stairs facing the road and a back door with flowers and benches facing the garden. That way the houses would interact with what they had around them.

- Another thing is the other buildings in C4. If you place a factory with its backside facing the road instead of the entrance that doesn't prevent the factory from working even if it is surrounded by other buildings. That happens because every building in C4 has a little space around the perimeter of the building where people can walk. That's not very realistic. The players should be forced to take into consideration the position of the building entrance when placing the building. They should be forced to have the entrace facing either a road or a piece of clear land.

- Another thing is the warehoure in C4. Graphically speaking, the warehouse has 4 drawn entrances but in therms of the game only one works. That's because each building is created with a pre-defined "access point" which the cart loader has to reach in order to interact with the building. I've seen cart loaders going all the way around the building to reach the "access point". I think that buildings should have the possibility of having several "access points" placed on the different entrances of the building.

- Finally, to complete all this, C5 should have an easy to use building editor to allow the players to create several versions of a particular building, for example a pottery factory with 1 entrance, another with 2 entrances to be placed on corners and another one with a triangular shape to be place on corners between ortogonal and diagonal roads. While creating the building the creator would have to put several items and rooms in the building (like ovens, tables, a cart garage, etc. for a pottery factory) in order to determine its production output. That way it would be impossible to create a very small factory with a giant output. While playing the game, the player would go to te menu, choose the pottery factory option and then the game would give him a window with the different versions of the the factory (with its statistics) for him to choose on and place on the city.


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