Are there problems to solve?

For everything SimCity Societies that doesn't fit elsewhere
Qwixt
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Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 6:41 pm

Are there problems to solve?

Postby Qwixt » Thu Nov 29, 2007 6:50 pm

I am considering getting this game, but the reviews have me somewhat hesitant. I have played SimCity since the first version on the PC, although I never played sc4. One of the things in SC that kept me playing was, as I expanded the city, problem areas would crop up that required attention. For instance, grid lock traffic would happen in one spot, and that section would need to be redesigned for better flow to allow an area to grow.

From what I have read here, and in reviews, SCS does not seem to have any of these little difficulties to fix. There are no worries about access to anything (e.g. electricity and water), and about the only thing that requires attention is something about building utilization.

So what problems must a player solve to grow a city?

FomarTHain
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Postby FomarTHain » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:10 pm

Basically all you worry about is getting folks to work by having venues that make them more willing to go to work. If they don't go to work they will go "rogue/get mad" and begin shutting your businesses down which of course makes it hard to earn cash to build more buildings and so on. It's not a brain teaser like I understand the SimCity games can be sometimes. Instead of a CitySim its more like a building sim. I liken it to more a toy more than game. One you just like playing with for whatever reason even if you can't define it. The definition probably drives the devs up the wall but that is what it feels like to me having gamed heavily for 13 years now.

I really like it but I didn't think I would. I came at it from a CBer stand point not a SimCity perspective. The minute I read there would be candy cane street lamps I said forget this thing. The more I heard people talk about it post-release the more I decided to give it a go so I went and bought it.

Regardless of me seeing it as a "toy" I consider it 50 bucks well spent.

Akodis
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Postby Akodis » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:52 pm

You can have the problems you choose to put in: crime, pollution, social conflict, traffic, etc. It's more about crafting a society than building a city, and if you choose to build an imperfect society, you have to deal with the problems generated by that society. Build a perfect society, and you have no such problems.

TreyNutz2
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Postby TreyNutz2 » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:53 pm

Qwixt wrote:So what problems must a player solve to grow a city?


I haven't found any serious problems provided you plan your city half well. Even if you don't, most likely you'll have plenty of cash to fix any issues. As far as the budget is concerned, it's pretty easy to achieve 'critical mass' for your city and be making money faster than you can decide what to do with it. At least in my experience.

The most vexing thing I've come across is rogue sims - very unhappy sims that can't for some reason spend enough time at venues to 'blow off steam' and thus go about shutting down workplaces. I've found that by paying attention to venue capacity, the hours the venue is open, and where the venues are in relation to work and home locations can help tremendously. Capacity of venues specifically right after work hours seems to be important. The game will show you which venues have reached maximum capacity, so you can easily tell if you need more and where.

That's about the only problem I've found you really need to 'solve' in this game. (Of course, that's a 'problem' only if I want happy citizens.) Crime can get bothersome (and I think angers workers which can also lead to rouge sims) but only certain buildings spawn criminals. Just by demolishing those buildings and using others I've been able to virtually eliminate crime. I don't know if high unemployment will also lead to crime, I haven't built a city with high unemployment yet.

If you want problems to solve it seems you pretty much have to manufacture them yourself. Like putting lots of criminal spawning buildings in your city then relying on police, jails, and similar buildings to deal with them. Or you can deliberately use too few venues and spend time micromanaging containment and rehabilitation of rouge, angry, and sad sims.

Traffic is hard to measure. You can visually see gridlock, but other than that I'm not sure the game can tell you which roads are particularly heavy. Regardless, if you place enough subway stations all over the map cars will virtually disappear. You don't even have to connect the stations and subways are fairly cheap.

The game doesn't really seem to throw you any challenges itself, but you can build in micromanagement if you want. It's more like a sandbox in that respect. If you want a city with vast slums (and all the problems with slums) that support a small uber-rich neighborhood, you can do that. But that's a situation you'll have to create for yourself.

Note: these are my impression after playing for maybe 10 hrs total in about 4 or 5 different cities. I'm having the C++ Runtime crashing issue, so I haven't been able to build a city that covers more than half the map, and most cities crash the game way before that. Some of my thoughts above could prove to be incorrect first impressions.

LadyCrimson
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Postby LadyCrimson » Thu Nov 29, 2007 8:59 pm

I pretty much agree with Fomar.

There can be 'challenges' - not so much as an aspect of the gameplay itself ala your changing buildings, but as self-made goals. ie, the rogue Sim aspect of the game can add make things more challenging, but they aren't an unavoidable roadblock in the game to make life difficult for you.

Qwixt
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Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 6:41 pm

Postby Qwixt » Fri Nov 30, 2007 7:02 am

Thank you for the feedback and help everyone. I decided, and went out and bought SC4 with the expansion finally. I have not got my SimCity fix in many many years, so looking forward to it. My reasoning went like this, I don't like to create my own problems, and SCS sounded a bit too much doll house-ish. Also, considering how long it has been since I played SC3000 (10 years?), it must say something that I remember the one huge city I had, and working through the traffic problems and other design problems.

Adagio
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Postby Adagio » Fri Nov 30, 2007 8:03 am

Qwixt wrote:So what problems must a player solve to grow a city?


There are no problems. You can get a successful city up and running by just placing buildings randomly
The hardest problem is to keep the game running, lots of people seem to have problems with crashes. The game hasn't crashed on my computer though (and now the game is gone forever, thanks to the wonderful uninstall utility)

Qwixt wrote:Thank you for the feedback and help everyone. I decided, and went out and bought SC4 with the expansion finally


Good choice. Make sure to check out SimTropolis for mods. As a minimum you should get the traffic mod, don't remember what it was called

Scorpius
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Postby Scorpius » Fri Nov 30, 2007 5:47 pm

Now, I understand what people are saying, but I don't agree that there are no problems to solve. There are just problems that are different than we have experienced in the past.

How do I build a cyberpunk city while keeping crime and pollution down?

How do I expand my farming community without turning it into something else?

How do I maximize efficiency in a hilly area, now that I can't flatten terrain?

DOMIGE
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My Problem..

Postby DOMIGE » Fri Nov 30, 2007 7:15 pm

Well, first of all i like it that someone cares about other one's problems..

so here is mine:

I installed the game, before i went to play a city,
I edited the Settings and options,
But when i clicked OK.
this happened ( see attachement )

Now I cant play the game , and edit my settings and options anymore..
what to do!! :eek:

Thanks in Advance
You do not have the required permissions to view the files attached to this post.

LadyCrimson
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Postby LadyCrimson » Fri Nov 30, 2007 7:50 pm

You already posted in the tech help area, cross-posting in another thread isn't neccesary.

I tried putting in another possible solution in your original thread. Don't know if it'll work, but you can try it.

Tinkerbell
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Postby Tinkerbell » Fri Nov 30, 2007 9:11 pm

Qwixt wrote:Are there problems to solve?


Absolutely!

Mah gameplay problems-to-solve list keeps growing faster than my solutions.

I absolutely love that! There are easy ways to play SCS, & then there is the fun way. :D

Chaos-R-US(Me)

Qwixt
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Nov 29, 2007 6:41 pm

Postby Qwixt » Sun Dec 02, 2007 8:18 pm

So I was reading another post, and someone mentioned the "Looking for goals? Want more of a Challenge?" post, which I missed. The game play described in the post sounds interesting to me, so I will probably pick this one up too since the price isn't too bad at amazon, $40 with free shipping. Oh, and SC4 is excellent. I was simply playing through the final rush hour tutorial, and I ended up wasting two hours messing with that city.

mountanddo
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Location: Minneapolis

Postby mountanddo » Sun Dec 02, 2007 10:42 pm

I, too went out and bought the SC4 Deluxe Edition. I don't find it that fun. Right from the getgo, I put in industry, commercial and residential with power and really nothing happens except for traffic delays. Doesn't matter how small your town is and it doesn't fix itself when you put in roads and avenues. The only thing I like was being able to drive the vehicles, but even that sucked cause you can't use the arrow keys, you have to use WASD. I can't steer with that. Oh well, see now I think that game was a waste of my money.

Rakeela
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Postby Rakeela » Tue Dec 04, 2007 1:53 pm

Tinkerbell wrote:Absolutely!

Mah gameplay problems-to-solve list keeps growing faster than my solutions.

I absolutely love that! There are easy ways to play SCS, & then there is the fun way. :D

Chaos-R-US(Me)

I have to agree with the post I've just quoted. Creating problems and writing stories about them can be a lot of fun. For instance, I had this late-stage authoritarian city, a sprawling complex that covered most of the map, and suddenly I started demolishing huge portions of it and replacing it with a cyberpunk city. I did it while using the same road network and replacing it piecemeal.

This "revolution" involved a sharp rise in homelessness, unemployment, crime, even riots. To keep with my story of a sudden, radical change, most of the buildings shut down by rogues were demolished, whether I'd meant to take them down or not. I had to deal with this in spite of running short on funds and needing radical changes still. And I was playing on normal!

Tontoman
Posts: 104
Joined: Fri Nov 05, 2004 9:57 am

Postby Tontoman » Wed Dec 05, 2007 10:25 pm

mountanddo wrote:I, too went out and bought the SC4 Deluxe Edition. I don't find it that fun. Right from the getgo, I put in industry, commercial and residential with power and really nothing happens except for traffic delays. Doesn't matter how small your town is and it doesn't fix itself when you put in roads and avenues. The only thing I like was being able to drive the vehicles, but even that sucked cause you can't use the arrow keys, you have to use WASD. I can't steer with that. Oh well, see now I think that game was a waste of my money.


You should look around for traffic mods. Here's a site for example, first one I hit on google http://www.simtropolis.com/modding/index.cfm?p=details&id=312 Should be others but been a long time since I played.

Qwixt, recommend you check out the mods also. EA didn't really release that polished a game.

Good old EA put on the box that the traffic code had been inproved in SC4 (it always was bad in earlier versions) but it was just PR. People still rarely used highways, I believe it was improved in the Rush Hour expansion but the mod is better still. Probably gone but there were posted experiments showing how dumb the sims where with the pathfinding. But the listed mod helps that greatly as people actually use highways now. Other portions of the mod can also increase road capacity, but I found just the pathfinding was all I needed.

I LIKED the traffic problems once the people were made smart enought use the new roads, as that was the type of challenge I liked and expected from a sim game. Nothing like bashing some buildings down, blowing lots of hard earned money, and then seeing the sims flock to the new highway and your traffic troubles elsewhere disappear.

Tonto.


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