Seemingly empty Wilderness, or is it?.....

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fleshtonegolem
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Seemingly empty Wilderness, or is it?.....

Postby fleshtonegolem » Thu Oct 09, 2008 9:29 am

I hadn't really seen or encountered much in the empty bits between realms of occupied spaces, and on my second time through the game I stumbled onto a chest smack dab in the middle of one.

Are their random things in the wilderness? (The empty unoccupied sections)


I would like to see more random elements like that if that is the case as I haven't encountered much.

Maybe some wild straw berries, or fruit trees. That would give you food.

An abandoned wagon or burnt out house with a few gold and a random item or two depending on the distance from your town.

Something else to click on besides loot. I like those types of things to find and their is a lot of land without much on it.

Nemeo
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Postby Nemeo » Thu Oct 09, 2008 2:11 pm

I want a GIANT tyrannosaur who wanders in unoccupied areas, and if you move while he's near you, he runs after you and eats you Jurassic park style!

"FREEZE GODAMN MORON! STOP TRYING TO STAND BEHIND ME!".

Yeah! that would be cool. That would explain why other races don't occupy those areas. Why do they attack you when there is free land near them? Simple: they don't know that tyrannosaur can't see motionless creatures.

Kiya
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Postby Kiya » Thu Oct 09, 2008 3:00 pm

"Nemeo" wrote:I want a GIANT tyrannosaur who wanders in unoccupied areas, and if you move while he's near you, he runs after you and eats you Jurassic park style!

"FREEZE GODAMN MORON! STOP TRYING TO STAND BEHIND ME!".

Yeah! that would be cool. That would explain why other races don't occupy those areas. Why do they attack you when there is free land near them? Simple: they don't know that tyrannosaur can't see motionless creatures.


Image That is really funny!

fleshtonegolem
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Postby fleshtonegolem » Thu Oct 09, 2008 6:18 pm

That would be funny. :)

A few random single monsters bosses would be cool. It would give you a reason to fully explore the map.

Seems to me there is a lot of empty space out there.

We should use it. ;)


Oh Ya I forgot to mention, the chest I found had both holy relics and some other nifty magical goodies.

Is this how they are typically found?

Innovan
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Postby Innovan » Thu Oct 09, 2008 6:22 pm

I'll pass on the dinosaurs.

What we'd more typically see in wilderness is:

A Gypsy trader that buys and sells things from her wagon.
AoE3 style nuggets. Which the treasure chests already are. (Adding guardians for nuggets though... wouldn't that just make it another area to be cleared on the TAB map then?)

What doesn't work for Hinterland that most other games have is:
Arms shop (someone selling all these weapons to the bad guys)
Armour shop (ditto)
Magic shop (ditto)
If you include those, you remove the need for building your town up. Instead, you just go there and buy what you want.
Last edited by Innovan on Thu Oct 09, 2008 6:28 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Nemeo
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Postby Nemeo » Thu Oct 09, 2008 6:41 pm

Put a really huge cyclop, or a really huge dragon, or a really huge tyranno... ok, we said no dinosaur. But a huge opponent with thousands of hit points. The kind of monster you have to be 4 level 15 with 30 potions to kill.

And have him attack the town without warning if the town's treasury ever rises over 500 gp. Some dragons and cyclops are told to be greedy. A single huge mob bringing hell to your city. Everybody dies. A little message from the game "Your reputation has changed to owned". The whole town to build again from scratch. And then "enemy raiders are attacking the village". Big fun.

fleshtonegolem
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Postby fleshtonegolem » Thu Oct 09, 2008 6:43 pm

I definitely don't think shops in the wilderness make sense in the general scope and theme of the game.

It would, like you said, negate the real reason and sense of accomplishment you get from having them made "locally" :)

More wild animals.

Bears, Wolves, Elk, maybe even a unicorn. :)

Kill it and give the horn to your necromancer for some radical powers. :)
or is you have a high enough level alchemist they could make a potion for you that raises one of your stats permanently.

They could also provide meat if you hunt it yourself.

I know there is already a hunting realm, but it would be cool if you got a few hunk of food when you killed a bear. It makes more sense than gold.

I have gotten valuable pelts from wolves. I thought that was pretty cool.

dcb33
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More wild animals .

Postby dcb33 » Fri Oct 10, 2008 2:17 am

We definitely need more wild animals.Feels a little depressing running through
the plains and not finding more animals like deer,boars or wild horses.I love horses just as much as i love this game .

Baxder
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Joined: Sun Oct 05, 2008 7:25 pm

Postby Baxder » Fri Oct 10, 2008 5:07 am

"Nemeo" wrote:Put a really huge cyclop, or a really huge dragon, or a really huge tyranno... ok, we said no dinosaur. But a huge opponent with thousands of hit points. The kind of monster you have to be 4 level 15 with 30 potions to kill.

And have him attack the town without warning if the town's treasury ever rises over 500 gp. Some dragons and cyclops are told to be greedy. A single huge mob bringing hell to your city. Everybody dies. A little message from the game "Your reputation has changed to owned". The whole town to build again from scratch. And then "enemy raiders are attacking the village". Big fun.


...Freakin' A! Bring it!

Innovan
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Postby Innovan » Fri Oct 10, 2008 5:23 am

It is possible that there isn't anything living in an empty area NOT because they're being chased off by Godzilla at every turn, but because there isn't enough food from lower down the food chain to support a top level predator in that region.

I strongly suggest reading

http://www.amazon.com/Why-Big-Fierce-Animals-Rare/dp/0691023646/

which is standard reading in Freshman level ecology classes to understand this better.

crossmr
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Postby crossmr » Fri Oct 10, 2008 6:29 am

"Innovan" wrote:It is possible that there isn't anything living in an empty area NOT because they're being chased off by Godzilla at every turn, but because there isn't enough food from lower down the food chain to support a top level predator in that region.

I strongly suggest reading

http://www.amazon.com/Why-Big-Fierce-Animals-Rare/dp/0691023646/

which is standard reading in Freshman level ecology classes to understand this better.


I'd have to drink a lot of alcohol to even remotely believe they put that much thought in to it.

fleshtonegolem
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Postby fleshtonegolem » Fri Oct 10, 2008 8:09 am

Crossmr and Innovan

I actually agree with you both.

I don't think every section should be occupied, but I do think more random stuff should exist. More importantly more random stuff you can do that isn't a prerequisite of beating the game. ;)

Side quests and such. Only side questing in this sense is merely cartography or orienteering.

Maybe a slider on the game options page when creating a new game that has something like

0-10% 10-25% 25-50% 50-75% 75-100%
Barren, Sparse, Common, Plenty, Ubiquitous

the percentage being the percent chance of an item or random wild life occupying that space.

It would make for an added depth at very minimal coding.

Nemeo
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Postby Nemeo » Fri Oct 10, 2008 9:44 am

Come on! What the hell is with the chest spawn calculation? Why bringing ecology in the debate in a fantasy game? Free land is like no one has ever lived here. There could be ruins or something but why putting a chest? Like opening a chest was soo interesting. There are already too many of them, with 15 coins or so in them. This game is not about discovery or wandering in an incredibly mysterious and wild territory. It's about looting, building and killing. Not in that order.

The game has NO boss. It needs a boss. The big wandering boss started as a joke but it's definitely a good idea. Spawn a leveled boss at randomly defined times (like 3 or 4 times in a game) and have him attack the town when the treasury is too high. Even better, give the boss the ability to slowly heal himself: you can give the player a chance to delay the attack by having the boss attack the city only if his health is full. Then the player, even if he's too weak, would have to put is life in danger if he wants to protect the town for ten more minutes, instead of letting the huge beast kill his level 1 peasants.

It would add a bit of fear in the game. Something unexpected, unwanted. Like when you were gently playing simcity 2000 and congratulating yourself at how great your city was when suddenly a HUGE DINOSAUR ATTAAAACKS. Those were good times. I'm sure hundreds of people would want to share their unexpected meeting with the beast.
Last edited by Nemeo on Fri Oct 10, 2008 9:54 am, edited 1 time in total.

tizubythefizo
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Postby tizubythefizo » Thu Apr 30, 2009 5:01 pm

me thinks flesh isn't getting the jokes, and is taking the replies a bit..WAYYY too serious. Inf act flesh,your posts are the only serious ones in the entire thread,lol.

Time to develop a sense of humor and realize when people are joking around ;-)

Xarne
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Postby Xarne » Thu Apr 30, 2009 5:32 pm

I like the idea of random things (non-combat) being placed in the open areas.
There's a ton of things that could be added to this game that would make it even more fun. Gypsy wagons, leprechauns, secret treasure maps or some half buried device that would help your town in the production of (x resource)

soldyne
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Postby soldyne » Sun Jul 12, 2009 5:56 pm

I like the idea of more random chests and guardian monsters in the wilderness areas. these areas could be optional, in addition to the required areas for completing the game. it would provide more to do, more XP to gain and more stuff to find which is what makes the game so fun.

these wilderness areas could house monsters and animals that are not normally part of the required set. You could go hunting for deer to gain food, you could find a rogue dragon (not red) guarding a horde. how about a lake with that mermaid or the dryad we keep seeing on the loading screen. Perhaps another adventurer with full gear who is looking to join your cause for free but you have to save him from certain doom first!

I don't like the idea of a super huge giganti-whatever, but, a larger than average boss type creature or two would be cool. maybe a beholder, or manticore, or chimera would be entertaining. something like that should still be optional but should also give a higher score and better rewards and should not show up on the map so it rewards exploration.

how about the next update is for sidequests like cave exploration, ruins or old wizards towers. A traveling merchant that is only available for a few days and only has a random assortment of items to buy like plows, daggers, instruments, a few pieces of armor, etc.

really, though, I would like to see all that empty space get used for something.

Moondoggie
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Postby Moondoggie » Sun Jul 26, 2009 6:12 pm

I like the idea of side quest areas, like an undead crypt, dragon's cave or something.The wilderness as it stands right now lacks any character or encounters that makes the whole experience of exploring fun.

But the biggest obstacle to adding exploration aspects in this game in my opinion is the horrendous camera. The dang camera is zoomed up so close i spend most of my time looking at the radar at the bottom than at my actual screen cause i can't see anything useful there anyway.

Shiniku
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Postby Shiniku » Sun Aug 02, 2009 12:57 am

I've run into some chests out in the wilderness myself, and I agree that it's nice. Whether it was intended or not, it is a slight reward if you explore those blank areas.

It's not like those blank areas have never been traveled through or ever camped on or anything - bands of raiders make that clear by walking across them quite often.

There are all kinds of other things that could be put out there too, and it would make this a deeper game. I like the idea of some difficult boss-type monsters out there, but I despise the idea of them attacking the town. Especially if it's a matter of gold. I want to stockpile gold? Good for me, I shouldn't be punished for it. Just recently I had to save up to plant herbs, which i waited too long to do, and it cost me 724 gold. Now, I didn't feel like taking on some sort of monster that would be powerful enough to destroy my entire town - I just wanted some damn herbs.

BUT, to have some harder creatures way out there that are completely avoidable, but offer a challenge for powerful characters, would be nice.

Dylmani555
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Postby Dylmani555 » Thu Jun 03, 2010 2:40 pm

Good ideas, I don't like the idea of the "boss" attacking with >500 gp because I often get to 500 gp very early.

Unrelated slightly:
1) Alchemists should be able to make dragon blood
2) Alchemists should need ingredients to make potions
3) The highest level area should ALWAYS be a base
4) The highest level base should have walls with a locked gate
5) The king has the key but doesn't think you are worthy of entering until you have cleared all other areas and have a certain elite villager
6) After defeating the final base, the main building of which should be a castle, an extremely hard enemy exits the castle, really mad that you have killed their army. Or maybe the base is filled with dragons and the final "BOSS" is the mother dragon, angry that you have killed her children, and if you are using a dragon then it won't fight her.

6 great suggestions :D


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